- Celebration - A larger event. Occasional. Relatively few people that you know.
- Congregation - 'regular' size. Regular in occurance. Know most people, some well, some not.
- Cell - small group. Regular in occurance. Know all people, pretty well. Deeper, personal application to discussion.
A idea was thrown in that some people only attend 'congregation' and do not engage in the other forms of 'doing church' at all. What are they lacking in that process - quite a lot, I feel.
Personally, I see the need for all of them but feel that if I only had them, in the form in which I engage in them, there would be something missing.
I have a 4th idea which I think is essential to my personal and spiritual growth, and though I have not come up with a 'c' name (!) it's worth consideration.
I guess it depends on how you engage in 'cell' and although I am happy and comfortable to share some stuff in that context, there is an even small group of people which I would class as my 'intimate' group - a word that was used for 'cell' yesterday, which I haven't used in my definition today.
These are the people who just simply know and understand. People who, within the context of 'church', don't always need words. People with whom you can share the silliest of 'stuff' because in that moment, it matters. People who understand your faith and share in your extravagance.
For me, my faith journey would be a completely different 'shape', if these individuals were not around.
9 comments:
I do agree. I think that Church is a great place to build really solid relationships with people who just get who you are and where you are going. I think, on a more open note, that 'u've' (in the plural sense of the word) got to be careful talking about cell groups. the truth is that they do do alot of good and i have no problem with them but the fact of the matter is that they are not what everybody wants or needs. I think that Romford, at times, risks excluding people who dont feel led to join one- making them feel as if they are somewho worse christians and not fully part of the church. That shouldnt be the case- ever. The Army can be full of enough exclusion as it is.
You're right Becks, there is enough exclusion in the SA and I am concerned that people in my church feel they are excluded if they are not in a cell. There is no expectation for everyone to belong to one, although there is plenty of opportunity, if that's what people feel led to do.I think the cell groups do have to be talked up, because, as an opportunity to belong with no strings attached, they are not on show like , for example the sections, which currently have their own hoops for folks to jump through. Do you think maybe that those feelings might reflect a lack of understanding about what Cell, or House Group is about? Question: What then do we have in place for or, who do people talk to if they feel excluded or threatened by something that is going on in their church?
Does this not bring it back to the question regarding being a Christian but not going to church?
In order to fully grow as a Christian, you need to be surrounded by like-minded people to learn and develop. Congregation does not allow you to do that to the full extent.
I often feel guilty for being involved - having the opportunity to go to Celebration, Congregation and Cell, but why should I.
Everyone in my church has the opportunity to do that. The difference?
I get off my backside and do something about it - I go. (most of the time!) Do people have the right to complain / feel excluded if they make limited / no effort?
I am with you Dawn, on the 'intimate group of friends' thing. I have benefitted greatly from that, especially recently. Without them, I would be in a bad place right now! Can I throw another one in. For those of us that have chosen to do this - having a mentor is another way we can 'do church'.
Hmm, an interesting debate, and this was part of a conversation I was sort of part of that resulted from Sunday night too.
Personally, I don't see why anyone would not feel 'led' to go to a cell group. I wouldn't say I was 'led', i just knew it was good sense, (and I happen to love it, so that kind of helps). I wonder sometimes if people who don't feel 'led' are using it as an excuse because they don't want to make the effort or don't want their spiritual journey have too much effect on the way they live their lives. (Note that I said I wonder sometimes, this isn't something I think I know, but it is something I sometimes wonder about.) I am sure that is not true of everyone, and that people have very valid reasons for choosing not to go. And, as Liz said, maybe many of them are scared or uncertain of what it is all about.
I think its quite difficult to know how to make those people feel included unless we know who they are, and why they feel cell is not right for them - and that means either us going to speak to them to find out, or them coming to us to tell us, and if that doesn't happen, it is probably more the fault of a communication gap than a problem of exclusivity. I guess this is as much my problem as others in that I don't talk to enough people in church that are not part of my 'intimate group of friends.' And maybe I should somehow show people that I am willing to chat with them, if they feel excluded, about why this might be, and how we can help that. I don't know how, but I would rather they told someone than just felt bad and excluded.
I don't think people are 'worse Christian's' if they don't go to cell, but I think that they run the risk of being 'less effective' Christians unless they have some other spiritual input which is more personal than 'congregation'. (i.e. like Dawn says, a great group of friends who you can and do talk to about how you spiritual journey is going, mentoring, or even just real honest commitment to personal Bible reading, prayer etc). I guess its quite difficult, (and harsh maybe), but spiritual growth does take effort on our part, and I sometimes worry that we get so concerned about making sure people feel good that we forget to encourage them towards spiritual growth. That we let people get away too easily with being a 'sideline' Christian, and in the process fail to help them to become more Christlike and therefore more effective in the Kingdom.
BUT I want to also point out that I really do want people to feel good, and I am aware that trying to force people to grow spiritually is not the way that God works. I am also aware that sometimes cell doesn't work for some people. So (after this essay), I guess its about trying to keep a balance and also about open communication to ensure that we try to do right by all.
Mostly I think we should pray about it, and for those people, and for God to show us who they are so that we can talk openly and honestly, and therefore try to help them towards greater spiritual growth. (Sorry for the length of this comment)
Hmm, just been thinking about my last comment, and wanted to say that whilst I don't take any of it back, I do actually recognise that I tend to expect a lot of myself, and sometimes I put that expectation on others unintentionally. I am trying to be careful about doing that, so I feel I ought to expalin. I am not saying people are wrong for not going to cell, I just happen to think that we have a responsibility to try to grow as Christians, and that cell groups is a good way of doing that. But if people are spiritually growing without them, then great.
Hope that sort of explains my thinking a bit more clearly.
Yes, I agree K, and the fact is that some people just don't want to go for what ever reason, or can't honestly find the time to fit it in.
I think D's right in what she says about those that say they feel excluded or seem to think they are thought less off.The evidence suggests that maybe those who attend cell come over as a bit smug which is maybe why 'people' feel they can't approach 'us' to talk about it?
All of this does suggest a 'them 'and us' situation which isn't good in a church,but happens in every situation where there are people.Can I also suggest that some of the folks who don't and/ or won't attend cell for what ever reason are themselves rather intimidating and make me feel as if they are mocking those of us who do! ..but perhaps that's a self preservation mechanism on their part?
We are all so vulnerable really aren't we really,them and us.
Does that come down to people having the image that cell group is a bit like pouring out your heart?...There because you have 'problems' almost, I suppose, like the image people might have of having counselling?
I don't think I am a 'weaker' individual because I like to address my faith in a more practical manner, and liek to talk about it and learn more, but maybe these 'other individuals' as Liz puts it, do have that view.
Hmm, yeah maybe. I can see that possibility. It could well be that maybe they feel they can be more independent in their faith, and therefore don't need to go to cell. But I read on Bec G's blog today the following statement, 'In reality only when honest feelings and emotions are shared can real people be known, loved and helped. Often patterns of superficial communications spill over into our talks with God.' which she says comes from the introduction to the psalms. Maybe those people just don't feel like they need to be known, loved or helped.
If you look in the gospels you'll see the idea of having a smaller nucleus of people is not new. Every time Jesus wanted to go really deep he just took Peter James and John with him. They formed his 'inner circle'.
I don't think it's about exclusivism, but rather recognising that in our human nature we only have room for a few people in terms of real intimacy.
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